How did Brad and Dave know when they'd "made it?" ALSO: Now that you have a website with a blog... what do you write??
How did Brad and Dave know when they'd "made it"? ALSO: Now that you have a website with a blog... what do you write??
Brad shares a heartwarming story about his dad's induction into the Michigan High School Bowling Hall of Fame. They discuss the concept of 'making it' as a cartoonist and the different definitions of success. They also address the challenges of rating one's comic in terms of age appropriateness and content warnings. In this part of the conversation, the hosts discuss how to handle sensitive content on websites and social media platforms. They mention using content warnings, marking sensitive posts, and utilizing tools provided by social media platforms. They also talk about the importance of considering the audience's age range and the different standards and gradations of content in various mediums. In the second part of the conversation, they discuss the use of blogs on websites and how they have evolved over time. They mention the historical use of blogs for SEO purposes and the shift towards social media for quick and easy sharing. They suggest using blogs to share a variety of content, including transcripts of comics, reposts of social media content, and updates on Patreon or other platforms. They emphasize the importance of not overthinking blog content and using the four C's: content, commercial, curation, and kindness.
ON TODAY'S SHOW:
CHAPTERS
00:00:00 Introduction: Brad's Heartwarming Story
00:07:29 The Definition of 'Making It' as a Cartoonist
00:11:13 Navigating Age Appropriateness and Content Warnings in Comics
00:44:30 The Evolution of Blogs
00:49:27 Using Blogs to Share Content
TAKEAWAYS
ComicLab (00:00.558)
I'm not sure if this is the right way to play it.
ComicLab (00:12.974)
Dave, I have such a happy thing to talk about at the beginning of the show this week.
My dad, who has been coaching high school bowling in Michigan for 17 years, found out that he was going to be inducted into the Michigan High School Bowling Hall of Fame. what? my God, that's a damn delight. OK, yes. Right. I mean, it's such a Michigan thing, too. And he was so, like, absolutely over the moon, thrilled about it.
And so we found out like two weeks before the ceremony. So he called because he called me. He wanted help working on his speech. OK, yeah. You've got to you've got to give a speech when you're inducted into the Hall of Fame. And of course you're going to call the son that does all the public speaking, you know, they're going to. That's right. Yeah, exactly. And he heard he heard about how well I did accepting the Ringo Award, telling that joke.
that I planned to bomb and he said, I don't want to do that, but something else kind of good to. Could we do something funny instead, son? Especially if you're going to be accepting a humor award, it would be, it would have been nice to do something funny, but this was, this was something else entirely and he wanted a little help. And so I got off the phone with him and I looked at my wife and I said,
I don't want to miss this. The man is 83. There's not going to be that many of these moments ahead of us. And I said, I know it's going to be ridiculously expensive, but I want to do this. I want, I, I.
ComicLab (01:57.422)
I want to go. Yeah. Yeah. So we looked at it and it was not quite as bad as I thought it was going to be, but it wasn't good. And long story short, I called up my niece who was going to be going with them. And I said, I'm planning on surprising mom and dad up there at the ceremony. Do you think you can help me out? She loved the idea of being my co -conspirator.
So long story short, it took me about five days to figure out the right people to contact to get tickets to the ceremony. Because, you know, she had asked dad and he says, yeah, you just called the bowling alley. Well, you know what happened when I called the bowling alley. I got some kid.
Who's standing there hating his life spraying red. I saw it in the shoes Hating and so he definitely did not want to help me out But can I can I pause you for a second? So what it's in it's in the bowling alley proper or it's adjacent or what is the setup for this thing David Kellett it is this wasn't just a bowling alley. This was Thunderball Arena
It was this entire... Of course it was. Of course it was. It was like three bowling alleys connected together. I mean, it was just bowling alley... Like, one of them had a ridiculous number of lanes, like 20 or 30 lanes. The one that we were on had a dozen lanes or so. And then there was yet another one that had a smaller number of lanes for like private, private parties. Wait, why? Okay, I know...
Sometimes the Midwest is a foreign country, but why would there be three bowling alleys right next to each other? And I'm not trying to be a stinker. I'm trying to parse this out. They were all for like different events. Like the one that we were in, the Professional Bowling Association, the PBA uses for, I think they held the World Series of Bowling there this year, but they hold pro level events at this one. So it's got to be. so this is the place.
ComicLab (04:01.23)
It's one of the places in the United States for sure. Definitely, I think for Michigan. But like this is a place like the alleys are oiled in a PBA format, all this other stuff. Sure, you gotta have that right oiling, yeah. yeah, listen, do not, if you ever want to get into a conversation that'll last a couple hours, you're asking me about comics or lettering? Ask my dad about oil patterns on bowling alleys. Holy hell no. Does it matter?
You've got to be able to read the oil pattern, Dave, or else how are you going to be a bowler? You've got to be able to read those patterns. What?
Well, this is beyond, I never imagined this. If you asked me things that mattered, I never would have said oil on the bowling alley. my God. Volumes have been written about oil patterns. It's like, you know how you and I can talk about the crossbar eye rule in A centers and B centers? Sure, sure. He can talk about oil patterns the same way. It's granular. God bless him. I mean, okay, so I stopped you mid story. So you fly out or you drive out? What do you do? I flew out. You flew out.
and the same weekend as the NFL draft was being held in Detroit, I'm flying into Detroit Metro Airport, which made things fun, too. And got a little, little hotel there in Romulus.
And Romulus. Wait a minute, what? Romulus, Michigan. Is there a nearby town named Remus? Why is it Romulus? I don't, you know what? I've asked myself the same question. I've not been able to find a Remus, Michigan, but there's definitely a Romulus. A lot of these were, a lot of these areas were Detroit suburbs. And Henry Ford actually named many of them, if not most of them. There was Lake Orion.
ComicLab (05:49.998)
Romulus, Sterling, Sterling Heights, all of these were, and some of them named after like Ford executives and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But so on the big day, Sunday, Shelby, my niece, make sure that they're seated with their backs to the entrance. she's got she's got her video all set up.
And I just walk up and kneel behind my mom. And my dad is talking to his assistant coach. I'm sure involving something like oil patterns or the right way to get your ball drilled. I mean, there's lots of stuff. And he's holding court with his assistant coach. And I just sit and wait for mom to catch me in her peripheral. And then she does. And she gasps.
Right? Which I'm not sure whether it was a great idea to surprise 80 something year old people, but there we were. There you go. What's done is done. Yeah, exactly. And and then my dad turns first words out of his mouth. What are you doing here?
And then I said, I, dude, I wouldn't miss this for the world. And we had this big, happy homecoming and I sat down and watched my dad get inducted into the Hall of Fame and deliver what I can only tell you humbly was a beautifully written speech. Well, I have to tell you, this whole thing makes me love you even more as a friend because what a good son.
to do this for your dad. This does not go unnoticed by his heart that you flew out for that. Because he taught for what, 17 years? 13 years? 17 years. 17 years he was a coach. That's a big part of his life and his identity and his reason for being. And the fact that you flew out for there to celebrate him, that is a good thing. And may we all have kids that do that for us when we're older. Yeah. I came back with my heart full. I really did. It just felt good to do.
ComicLab (07:58.062)
Also, I just love this for America that there's a Michigan bowling Hall of Fame I just for those that are out of the country bowling is I know in England they have some bowling alleys around London I don't know if they have any in Australia or anything But bowling is this unique American sport that the average American plays once every two years and then your arm hurts the next day
But we used to do it like once a week, right? There used to be bowling teams and all sorts of I mean, I know there still are Ostensibly, but you have to admit that culturally it's faded from the 50s and 60s This was something that reached its peak in the 1970s. By the 80s it started to curtail a little bit And and I it may be having a little resurgence right now. There's there's been a whole thing I don't know that you've seen it. There's cooler bowling alleys being redone or built. Yeah, exactly And and and also there's a new
I guess now it's okay to bowl with two hands. Have you seen the two -handed approach? What? No, like through the legs? What, you and I, well, not through the leg, but they do it like side saddle and they release it with two hands. You'll see a lot of two -handed bowlers now and I guess it's approved by the PBA. So it's having a, and there's some people that really bowl well with two hands.
I mean the people that figured it out because that's for the oil patterns. With two hands you can very easily play the oil. I can't believe that knowing the oil patterns makes a goddamn difference in throwing a ball down a road. I mean that's a level of skill. My level of skill is hey I hit a pin.
So that's a that's a whole other world to be able to say I read the oil patterns in order to make a perfect strike But on that note I'm gonna say hello everybody and welcome to comic lab the show about being a damn good son and Making comics and making a living from comics. I'm Brad Geiger editor of the web comics handbook on sub stack
ComicLab (09:52.27)
What is this new intro? my goodness. I got to tell you, I got to tell you, I need to start promoting it more because it's it's I've really been enjoying the the experience on Substack. So I'm basically mirroring Webcomics .com on your Substack. And the results have been fantastic. So I thought at the top of the show, I would I would change it to Webcomics Handbook on Substack.
Well, this is great. Thank you for forewarning your friend that you were going to change it up. This is awesome. Now go ahead and take it fresh so that everybody hears your intro. I don't want to ruin it. I've been meaning to do it for two months, but I haven't written it down on this sheet of paper. So I just thought I would just throw it in there today because I keep every time we get done recording, I'm like, OK, I got to write that down at the end of the show. And then I never do. Well, you've been busy writing bowling speeches. So that's, you know, I get it. I've had things to do, you know? Yeah.
But do take it from the top. I want people to hear it fresh. Where can they find Brad Geiger? I'm Brad Geiger, the editor of the webcomics handbook on Substack and the creator of Evilink. And I'm his friend, Dave Kellett, cartoonist of Drive and Sheldon and co -director of Stripped. And this week's Hour of Comics advice is made possible by your support at patreon .com slash comic lab. So Dave, Dave, let's talk comics.
Let's talk comics, my friend, we have a huge batch of great questions this week and an update on my Alaska comics trip mid show. But let's jump in, Brad, right away with our first question over from Patreon .com slash Comic Lab, which everybody is joining to get to 500 by 50. And when we do, you get two episodes of Drunk Comic Lab. So join us over at Patreon .com slash Comic Lab. And Brad, here is the simple question to start the beginning of the show here. Brad, when did you realize?
You had made it quote unquote. I'm going to be honest with you. I'll let you know when it happens. You got my stupid laugh out of me. In all seriousness, and I'm not being like false humility or any of that stuff. Do you feel like you've made it? Well, on a lot of senses, no. And on some sense, and then when I stopped to think about it,
ComicLab (12:10.862)
Logically, yes. So I'm of two minds about it, but I absolutely 100 % cosine and agree with the mood that you started with, which is that I'll let you know when it happens because it's it's an ongoing journey. And frankly, for me, let me put it this way. Every year that I continue to be a cartoonist, just getting to be a cartoonist, that's quote unquote making it, you know. And so if if by the end of 2024, I'm still doing it, then I made it. And so on that level, I'm like, great. But on another level,
sort of the cartooning life that I envisioned when I was 13, for example, has not happened and frankly will never happen because newspapers went away, you know? So the sort of childhood aspirations that I had have evaporated and now a more realistic adult version of making it has sort of taken its place. And I think largely, I recognize logically that I check most of those boxes, but emotionally I don't feel that I've made it a lot of days.
No, and that's how I feel too. I've been doing this independently as my, you know, the main source of my income for 10 years now. I left the daily news in 2012. So 12 years actually. I was going to say, good God, Matt boy. Good job. But I think, and this has been, you know, my central thing, but every year I wonder if I'm going to be able to pull it off for another year. Yeah. And,
And when you're like, and this year, I mean, we've talked for just about every show in 2024, we've talked about how there's a major upheaval in social media and everything that we're doing is taking a main shift. And so like I'm filled with a lot of question marks, a lot of fear, a lot of trepidation. And even beyond that.
A lot of the a lot of the things that are happening with like MasterCard making it harder to accept payments for NSFW content, stuff that have always been kind of in the center of the tent that I'm pointing out. It's it's it's it's it's it's really scary. And and I never thought of.
ComicLab (14:29.39)
this level of thinking on your feet and accommodating and adapting to be somebody who's made it. I would think somebody who's made it doesn't have these fears anymore. They just sit back and cash their checks. Right. And they just, they've made it right. When you've made it, you stop worrying quite so much because you made it. And there are Mick Jagger has made it. Right.
Right. Any number of authors that we know, Stephen King has made it. I don't know that I am ever going to be in that position. So I actually maybe this is worthwhile to define it. What to what to you is making it? Is it financial success? is it career accolades? Is it having built an audience or is it some mercurial mix of all three of those? And you'll kind of know it when you see it. I.
Financial? Financial!
Listen, if I was doing this for accolades, I would have quit a long time ago. Accolades, you know, sometimes you get them, sometimes you don't. And you can't. We've said this so many times. We know a lot of people who have heavy accolade comics that are clearly not making. So, yeah, financial. The point at which I stop worrying about next month.
Right. Financially. Right. Then I will have made it when I've got that buffer of money. I've got a whole bunch of money in savings when I'm not, you know, worried about what the hell am I going to do when I retire? What the hell am I going to do? Well, let's face it, we're not retiring. And I don't think that makes us any different from other people who went more traditional routes because we've already seen pensions and 401ks and all that stuff go up in smoke.
ComicLab (16:28.174)
Right. So I think there's a lot of people dealing with that. But all the same, when I'm not worried about it, and it happens on the first day of every month where I studiously try to not look at my Patreon payout until late in the day on the first to see, did I lose a whole bunch of people? Did I hold ground? Did I maybe gain a little bit of people?
Right. When I'm not doing that on the first day of the month, that I'm just cashing that check when it goes in, when I'm waiting until the fifth of the month to let it auto pay instead of hitting that button on the first because I got bills to pay right now. Right. When that happens, then I'll make it. Then I will say, Brad, you've made it. But until then, I'm making it. And there's a difference between making it and made it. Right. Right. Well, I will say this. I have largely.
figured out how to meet my financial goals for a year. And it usually involves one and a half to two books a year. And I say one and a half because sort of statistically, not every year gets two books, but on average, if you work it out about one and a half to two books a year. And last year, my wonderful full -time assistant Beth had maternity leave for six or seven months there. And we didn't put out,
any books in 2023, I don't think. And whole Nellie did that year take a hit by not putting out two books. So the next 18 to 24 months are actually really exciting because it's going to be like four books, bang, bang, bang. We've already got two of them done. And the next one will be kickstarting the summer. But it's it was telling to me that if I don't keep up a schedule of books, the sort of system that I built, whereas.
Comic -Con sales are resulting from the most previous Kickstarter book. And if that was done in the last six months, then great. That Comic -Con appearance is going to be great. And then sightings are going to be great. And then, you know what I mean? Like Christmas sales will be great. It all sort of knocks on one another. And as soon as I remove one of those pins, it stops falling over like a bowling pin. That's what I was trying to get at there with the bowling pin metaphor. Like a bowling pin, of course. You remove one of those pins.
ComicLab (18:48.366)
less things fall over. So what I'm getting at is there is I have figured out a system and the system is repeatable, and it's workable. And I'm happy with my career where it is. But it's interesting to me that if I were to say break my wrist for six months or a year, boy, howdy, would I be in trouble. And so anyway, all that to say is I'm very happy with where I am in my career. I'm very happy with the post pandemic, both of us working from home system.
that my assistant Beth and I have where I think we're both happier allowing a little personal space. She'll come into the office once every two weeks or three weeks or something. And that's perfectly lovely. Although I do miss both of our dogs getting together, which was always fun. Brad doesn't care about that at all. But what I'm saying is like, I'm, as terms of making it, I'm very happy being a cartoonist. I love my career.
Brad, you have to admit you're very happy being a cartoonist. Listen, I'm overjoyed. I'm I'm in a very, very rare position to be able to do this for a living. And I realize that and and and that fall again, it falls under the heading of making it like I am very proud that I'm making it. I'm super, super proud that I've been doing it for 12 years. Right. But.
This person is talking about how do you know when you have made it? And I'm telling you, there's a huge difference in my mind between making it and having made it. Yeah, I don't necessarily disagree with that. I do think that I'm a little more generous in the term. I think of making made it in the sense that I think one largely when within two or three years of having left Mattel Toys and just doing cartooning and proving to myself that I could do it year after year.
That was sort of an, to answer the question, that was sort of an awareness of I had made it. But again, that's more generous than Brad's definition. It's fine. It's totally subjective anyway. But we're both under the understanding that every year is a new year and every year you have to sort of reprove yourself, Brad, if that's one way of saying it. Or if not reprove it, at least pay the bills is another way of saying that. So every year is a new year of making it. And then artistically, in terms of making it and being the artist I want to be,
ComicLab (21:04.718)
I genuinely am always sort of 10 years away from being the artist that I wanna be. I've said it before, but Miyazaki had some kind of quote that like, and he said this in his 60s or 70s, I think he said, somewhere around 85, I feel like I'm gonna be a good artist. And that's both heartbreaking, but also true because a lot of us always feel over the course of our career, we look back in five year or tag near segments and you can see the progress. And so I always feel like, in 10 years, I'm gonna be really good.
And right about then, I'm going to start losing my vision and losing my ability to draw probably. And so isn't that a shame, but such is life, I guess. And then you have to mop up those drool puddles on the top of your tablet and all that kind of stuff. So, Dave, let's take another question from one of our Comic Lab Patreon backers. And it goes like this. Hi, Brad and Dave, could you talk a bit about how to rate one's comic in terms of age appropriateness and...
what to look out for when posting it. I understand that if I post on social media platforms, I have to comply with their policies, but what about my own website? What about using swear words and violence and what about implicit sex scenes or maybe even explicit sex scenes, I think is what they meant. Like how series on Netflix, et cetera, do it. How much nudity is too much. When is violence too explicit?
Is NSFW only explicit sex scenes? How much do I have to censor for it not to be 18 plus anymore? I'm confused as to what I'm quote, allowed unquote to do. And what precautions I have to take if my comics, for example, contain sex scenes, swear words, violence, and the characters getting killed. Thanks in advance. And all I know for sure is all of a sudden I want to read this person's comic.
That's funny. So I will answer first with broad strokes, which is if you're feeling confused, congratulations, you're part of modern society. So it's this this is literally arguments that entire societies go to war about in terms of with themselves over what is appropriate, what is not appropriate, what is kid friendly, what is not kid friendly, what is.
ComicLab (23:23.182)
what society in general welcomes versus what it is not. And so you will see markedly different reactions around the world to varying things. In Europe, you'll have much stronger warnings about violence. America, you'll have much stronger warnings about sex. In Japan, age ratings are remarkably and shockingly low in terms of both what you see and what can be appropriate. And so,
Every society sets different levels to this and it's tricky because even artists with their own ethical and moral compasses can set it differently. It's really tricky. And then that's the broad strokes. Brad, before we get into the brass tacks, do you have any sort of broad strokes answers to this? My broad stroke answer is that if you're looking for a formula or a standard or some place for guidance, good luck because you're not going to get one.
In fact, we even, if you take everything Dave said about different societies and cultures is absolutely true. But let's say if we just take American culture and, and focus our attention on that, the movies have one system. TV shows have another system. Streaming TV has a different system. Video games has another system. A book publishing.
They tend to kind of take a hands off approach to it. If you notice, you never see a novel as far as I've ever noticed with with a content warning or an age rating. All of which to say is that. And I can I can I stop you there, Brad? Among graphic novel and manga companies, though, you will see age gradings, all of which are different from the other ones. So there's no industry system there. Yes.
So just backing up your point that you were making. Yeah, absolutely. There's no standard. So there's good news and bad news in that. The bad news is that there's not one place that you can go to that is a universally recognized authority on this. And even if they were, could you imagine what that would read like? It would be really difficult.
ComicLab (25:41.006)
to do like a one size fits all kind of approach to content. So the bad news is there's no place to go to find an authority. The good news is, is that you can kind of follow your gut on this. And in my opinion, and it's just my opinion, I would think that nobody could justifiably fault you.
for your content rating because you're doing it in good faith. You're saying this is something I'm concerned about. This is something that I'm trying to do something as to be a good person, a good faith actor on the internet. So if you're doing this in good faith, I don't see how anybody could justifiably take a swipe at you. It's very nice that you're considered
considering doing this in the first place. Yeah, the one thing I based on your question there, the one thing that I would hold you up on is when I see content warning about the next page that you're about to flip. Now, this is more specific than than we were talking about before, which I feel like breaks the sort of implied promise between author and audience of sort of suspension of disbelief and also
immersion in the world. I see where you're coming from. Because here's the problem. If the story was done, and finished and put to bed and you were about to hand it to a reader physically, right? You would put some kind of if you wanted to put it, you would put some kind of warning at the front saying like, hey, if you're a soldier with PTSD, you're going to see some stuff in the story that maybe you'd want to skip or hey, there's going to be this age appropriateness. Maybe this is a story is 18 plus or 16 plus or something like that.
and you would put it at the beginning of the story or the back of the book or something like that. And that would be the end of it. But I understand the problem is we're largely creating our stories installment by installment, right? Whether it's page by page, comic by comic, day by day, week by week, whatever you have you. So I can see why 300 pages in not needing a warning, but then suddenly realizing that, my God, you're about to have a battle scene and that could be PTSD for a soldier.
ComicLab (28:07.15)
that you want to warn them. But the problem is, now someone who's reading along happily suddenly gets to this content warning and they're like, well, now I know there's a battle coming up or someone's about to be killed or there's a beheading or whatever it is that you're about to show. And it just breaks the narrative flow and the narrative and by narrative flow, I mean more the readers narrative flow in that they're there. Sort of you sort of have suddenly shaken them out of the story and back to real life, right. And it
it's just not fun storytelling. Like imagine you're around a campfire, someone's telling a story, and then pauses and in a different tone of voice goes, okay, now, now everybody here that needs to leave the fire. This is the time to get up because I'm about to talk about a battle that happened between the Greeks and the Persians in the third century. And so half this fire gets up and leaves. It's just weird. It's a weird thing to do. So I just want to recognize that I don't have an answer for that other than to say normally.
You would give the warnings at the beginning of the story. People could, could give a pass if they wanted to. It's weirder to do it mid story. Yeah. And that's why I think like two places that I would consider if you're going to do this, if you decide it's a good fit for you is either, you know, on a the cover of your book, that's a, that's a no brainer B at the top of your website, right? That's a perfectly fair place to put it and C,
on your profile page for your different social media networks. I think if you have it on the profile page, that's about as good as you can do without it again, like Dave says, although, you know, not for nothing. If you put a content warning on the post above on the page itself, not the page, but the post like like in Twitter, you've got the words and then you've got the image. If the words part says,
content warning, you know, blah, blah, blah in that, then they can decide whether they're going to click on that image to expand it or not. Right. Right. So you could do that with minimal. I mean, it's going to have an effect, but a minimal effect. And the good news there is that, yes, your long time readers are going to be taken out of the surprise of seeing the battle that you've been building into.
ComicLab (30:30.734)
On the good side, you're not going to hit somebody who just came across your comic for the first time today and sees somebody's hand getting chopped off, you know, or something horrible that they weren't expecting. So you could do that. Also, not for nothing. And I'm surprised it's taken me this long, but you'll have to forgive me. I'm just remembering that a lot of these social media platforms have built in tools for you to say, Hey, something sensitive is coming up.
Right. I genuinely didn't know that. So if I post something for Evil Inc. after dark that has a certain degree of nudity in it, right, I can mark that on Twitter, for example, as being sensitive. I can flag that and I can flag it as either being violent, sensitive or nudity. Right. And then can the user change their account settings? What happens is that user will see a grayed out box.
I see. Okay. Sensitive topic, click to enlarge or something along those lines. Or make clear or whatever. They make the decision to click on that to see it. And if they don't want to, then they're, you know, they never have to click on it. And I believe Macedon has something similar to that. I think many of the platforms do. So if the platform you're using has that.
You can also use that as a way to make sure you're not catching somebody off guard. That's okay. That's immensely helpful. Especially if you're on a platform based system. I think there's, I have a vague memory that Patreon might offer that as well. Patreon definitely offers it. Okay. And then my one thought is I wonder if WordPress has that as a setting where you could like go ahead and why it's a big smile. no. As a matter of fact, I know the answer to this one. So.
it without going into a whole long thing, I was going to post something on my main website that I wanted to exactly this thing. I didn't want some, it had nudity. I wanted to put it on the evil link website and I, but I didn't want to catch people off guard of, on it. If they've been used to coming to the main evil link website and not seeing full nudity. So there was a WordPress plugin called short codes and it gives you a whole bunch of short codes. One of them,
ComicLab (32:54.318)
is basically a window shade. So it says basically click on this to open the image. You click on it and like a window shade coming up, it gives you the image. So if you don't want to see it, you never have to click it. So yes, the answer is on WordPress, you absolutely can do that. That to me seems like a really good solution is you could put a tiny bit of text above just that page.
Yeah, saying like, hey, just a content warning. This is conceivably what you might see on this page. Again, though, that doesn't break the narrow structure. Yes. But if you're worried about it and you're updating on a weekly basis, that's probably as close as you'll get to an ideal situation. I will say that.
It's tricky because what I consider offensive or worthy of a content warning is not what Brad would consider offensive or worthy of a content warning, is not what you would be considered offensive, is not what a parent, is not what a grandparent, like literally everyone has a different definition. It's quite hard because my definition is far more vanilla probably than others. And...
So it's a really tricky subjective thing. The best you can do, as Brad said, is to follow your own moral compass and ethical compass and your readership. If like your readership is clamoring for stuff, maybe listen to the readers, not a reader, but it is worth just keep, if you're concerned about it, it is worth keeping an ear about or open to those concerns. Especially if your comic straddles that.
very difficult to navigate period where it could be read by someone between eight and 18. That is where everybody in most societies is most concerned about content. Right. So for Sheldon, I have no problem because it can be read by eight year olds. For Drive, I have a little bit of problem because there's some violence that could be read by maybe, I don't know, low teens, I would guess. For Brad, he's more on the high end of the spectrum for Evil Inc. and then definitely higher on the spectrum for Evil Inc. after Dark.
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But what I'm getting at there is that like if you are definitely not suitable for work all the time or very violent, well, then you know, just have a standing content warning on your site for 18 and up. And if you're like Sheldon, who steers on the far side, if dang near everything is going to be for eight plus, then you're fine. You don't need a content warning. But it's the weird eight to 18 year old period that that's there's all sorts of weird gradations there, too. And especially if you go to a manga aisle, you'll see
And I'm going to get this wrong, but you basically see gradations of T for teen T plus for I think it's like 16 plus or something. Teen plus plus. I don't remember what they are different systems, but there's like mature. There's like teen, you know, basically 18 plus. So there's all sorts of different gradations in there, just like the movies, just like TV shows, all of which are different, all of which are confusing, all of which have their own standards. So.
Not really a satisfying answer, but I think of the direction of a satisfying answer to it. Yeah. And I'll just if you are interested in that, the one that I have used the WordPress plug -in, I just looked it up to make sure I pointed you in the right direction. It's called WP Short Codes Plugin, and it's by Vova Anakin.
And it worked like a charm for me. It was, it was exactly. Plus it's got a whole bunch of other short codes that you can use that I can't imagine them. I'm not going to use any of them, but they're there in case I ever need them. Sure. Sure. Sure. But that is one way to make sure that you're addressing this on your website, which if you do have violence or occasional nudity that you don't want to catch anyone off guard by, you can certainly make that choice to do it.
Hey, if you're listening while you work, take a minute to stand and stretch. And while you're doing that, we're going to tell you why you should join us on Patreon. When you do, you're going to get hours and hours of podcasts that we recorded just for backers and exclusive Patreon posts that go even deeper on Comic Lab topics and access to our exclusive Discord server, which is a thriving community of professional cartoonists. So you can support the show you love and get tons of actual resources for your own cartooning.
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And listen, if you can't swing a pledge this month, we get it. No worries. Yeah, yeah, listen, you can still support the show by rating us wherever you get your podcasts. Just leave a five -star review and a few kind words. That, along with mentions on social media, is incredibly helpful. Now, everybody, let's talk comics.
Well, Brad, a quick update mid show here. I just wanted to update everyone that I just got back from Alaska Comics Camp, which there is an entire episode in 2019. I think if you literally Google search Dave Kellett's report on Alaska Mini Comics Camp, there is a full hour report of what this comics camp entails. But the short version is it's a three or four day camping excursion for about 40 to 60, maybe 70 cartoonists.
up to Juneau, Alaska, we all fly in, we do a mini Comic Con for one day, it's about a seven day Comic Con in Juneau, Alaska, people from all over Alaska, I had people flying in on puddle jumpers from Anchorage and this that readers, it was great. They come in, we do a one day Comic Con, sort of helps recoup costs. We do, if people want, they can do school visits and do little lectures for around schools around Juneau, which is really fun. And then we all hop on basically a Muppet bus,
and drive out about 30 miles outside of town to a camp. And we teach one another classes. We do all sorts of our art experimentation in terms of like, hey, have you ever tried watercolor? Come try my watercolor class. Hey, have you ever made your own paper? Hey, have you ever made your own color tints? Do this or that, all that sort of stuff.
And so it's about three or four days and we also laugh tremendously of laughter as it fills the days. It's so great. And in the meantime, you're out in the wilds of Alaska. The air is fresh. It's good for the soul. You are among a huge group of like -minded artists who are all trying to make a career in cartooning and all of whom love the art of comics. And it is...
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And I'm not kidding about this. I don't want to undersell it. It is among the most joy filled, heart filling days that I have all year long. And I am so thankful to Pat and Erin and Marion, who organized the event. And I made so many new friends from all over the world, from Japan, from Canada, from the US this year. And I cannot recommend it enough. So next year, I think it's around somewhere between December and January, maybe November.
I want you to Google Alaska Comics Camp and keep an eye out for the application. It's a really simple one page application. And if you can, at some point in your life, join us. We've had about five or six cartoonists from Comic Lab, from listening to that episode and from the subsequent years, come out and join us. And I'm happy to report that they all had a lovely time. And it was so fun to meet these cartoonists. It's a wonderful mix of pro -am and pro -cartoonists. Literally some of the biggest names you've ever heard of.
I've been out there. It's got Chatham House rules, so I can't tell you who goes, but it's great. And I, again, I am a fairly joy -filled guy. My bucket is so full of joy coming out of this weekend. It is just, it's basically friendship and community and comics making. And I am so.
and thankful for it. So that's my summation, Brad. That's it. There's no, I mean, anything else that I missed to update people about it? Other than the fact that I've said it two years in a row, but I am really, really desperate to get out there and enjoy this sometimes. It really does sound like a fun time, a great place. Yeah, I say it in friendship, Brad. God, I hope I'm not wrong, but I think you are going to love it. Also because...
It's kind of wonderful to be at a stage in our cartooning career where we can give back to the younger cartoonists that are there. Like, I've taught some classes there. I've given some talks there in terms of like, and it's very impromptu. Like last year, I and three other cartoonists who all write comic based or humor based comics, we gave a talk on how to write comedy for comics. And it was really fun. And we laughed a lot. And it was so fun to pay it back or pay it forward rather. And I think you as a cartoonist,
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of many years and many decades now will love that aspect of it. You'll learn to don't get me wrong, I learned all sorts of stuff this past week, but you I think you'll also appreciate paying it forward, which we didn't have when we were younger from certain cartoonists. And so it's really enriching on all sorts of levels to go to this camp. So I can't recommend it enough. So do make a note in your calendar to Google Alaska comics camp.
and set a reminder to apply somewhere in November, December of next year or this year, rather, you will not regret it. And we'll try to have a note there in the Comic Lab Discord server as well, where we often keep people up to date on these sorts of opportunities. So make sure if you are a Comic Lab Patreon member and if not, why not? But if you are, make sure you're using your Comic Lab Discord access to get that and all kinds of other great rewards that are at your fingertips.
So Dave, I've got another question and actually, Dave, this one warms my heart. Actually, for the same reason the last one did too. My heart's very warm today is what I'm trying to say. Brad, you need to see a doctor. Well, this because if you'll notice, our previous question asker was talking a lot about what to do on their website, right? In terms of content ratings, along with other places. And here's a person that is also has a
website centered concern. And I think a lot of people have been hearing us say for the past several years, frankly, but it's been, we've really ramped it up over the last several months about the importance of a website right now as social media is completely dead. And I think, I think some of our readers are and listeners are taking it seriously. And it thrills me because I really do believe in it, but.
Here's if you are one of these people who are now re -examining a website or examining it for the first time, you might have this same question as this person who says, Dear Comics Uncles, I am in the first year of my webcomic and would like to ask about the blog section that usually appears below the comic on a website. I see that both of you use it to promote your KickStars, Patreons, books and merch. However, as a new webcomic without
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any of those things and rightly so good for you. How should I use my blog? Thank you for everything you do and for sharing your knowledge. And Dave, I ask you, as we're going back and addressing or readdressing our websites, what are you doing with your blog? Well, let me start with a little bit of historical stuff and then I'll go into what I'm doing now and what I think I will be doing, ideally in the next six months to two years. So historically,
blogs got started because keep in mind on the internet early internet video took impossibly long to download photos even even photos took a tricky amount of time. It was expensive to host and serve up images if you remember Brad those early days. yeah. And so the the power of the written word was strong in the early internet, especially before social media. So to accompany our frankly,
small comics images and they were small. I remember some of them were like 600 pixels wide or so. How tricky to read, especially when you had horizontally oriented comics not ideal. I don't know what we were thinking. But well, what we were thinking is we all wanted to be in newspapers. That's what we were thinking. Right. So small images and we would we would sort of puff out the rest of the website by filling in the blog post, we talk about what we did that day, what we were hoping to do.
fun things we had found on the internet, sharing links, sharing other web cartoonists critically in the blog, we would talk one another up a lot. And then on the rare days, because this was the early internet, on the rare days where we had a new book or a new t -shirt, or we're making an assigning at this or that Comic -Con, we would talk about it in the blog post. So it became the sort of catch -all.
that has since been replaced by social media because now social media, you launch the app, bada bing, bada boom, within seconds, you've shared about a signing or a book or a Kickstarter or a Patreon. And so the blog used to be what social media has now become. And I will be honest that social media for me personally, largely took over that role. It was just easier for me to tweet a thing.
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Then to launch my website, log in, go to the blogging engine, type in the unique, sometimes formatting of a blogging engine, grab the weird hyperlinks, sometimes put in the coding for the hyperlinks, back in the day. And so it just, it wasn't super quick as social media became quicker. And so the human heart being what it is, it tends to go to the easier thing. And so I use social media. But now that social media is falling apart, I will be honest, I think,
In some future moment, I will start using my blog more the way I use social media. I don't know how I will do that. Because again, some of those problems of logging in going to the blog engine doing the thing like all of that is a couple minutes of work usually done at a desktop, not at a phone. Yeah. And so it's not as immediate. Now having said all this, I would like to bring in my friend Brad Geiger and hear what he has to say about his past use of blog engines, his current use of blogging and his future use of blogging.
Well, that's a great topic. So let's start here. And that is that there's one thing that you didn't mention that we really do need to talk about in terms of past use and future use. What was the big reason that we blogged not only for outreach and all the things that you mentioned, but the number two reason or sometimes number one reason that we blogged?
was for SEO, search engine optimization, because especially back in the day, they were the only way that Google or any other search engine could spider through our sites and find a clue as to what was on that page. That's true. You're right. Yes, I completely forgot that, yes. So we've got to remember SEO. Now, my thinking on search engine optimization is fluid right now.
because I think we're going to have to start paying attention to it a little bit more than we used to. But I also know that Google isn't Google anymore, right? It isn't that they don't do things the way they did it. They're doing a lot of AI in their search results and delivering search. And as a result, they're getting worse and worse and worse. And as a result, people are going to start finding other ways to solve those problems.
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All of which to say, SEO has taken a step up from what it used to be for the last 10 years, but it's not top of mind, top of mind for me right now. However, it's something that we're going to have to keep on our radar. So one of the reasons that we blogged was to have words on our site that people could easily find. So I'm going to say that.
One thing that you could do that might, depending on how you're working, might be very easy, almost for some of you, a cut and paste or a copy and paste. Not for me, and I don't think for you quite so much, but for some people is to put a transcript of your comic in the blog. Gives you a little usable thing you can have down there and it gives Google and any other search engine something to spider and.
If you are one of the cartoonists who makes the choice to do alt text with your images, having that transcript is going to be something that you can use twice. And you know me, I like to have things that I can use multiple times. So if you decide that that is a good fit for you, then you can do that as well. Also, I see I see a lot of people saying, well, I don't know what to blog. I don't know what I should put in the blog.
And there, and, and again, I'm going to drop back to that, the tried and true of do it once and use it a lot of times that you have to do when you're an independent, creator. So I'm going to tell you number one, you never, well, sometimes we do, but we have less of a problem of figuring out what to post on social media, right? Again, going back to the four C's that was,
an attempt of a way to give you some ideas of some of the things that you could post on social media when you weren't just posting your comic. So if you've been tweeting all along, you've already got a whole bunch of blog material because it's all of those tweets and all of those posts that you've been putting on Facebook and on Blue Sky and all the others. You've already got a bunch of text that you own that you can put up there.
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Now, whether you want to pull it a tweet from 2019 is up to you. But if you want to pull a tweet from last week, absolutely. Yep. Yep. Yep. All of that is yours. Also, we've seen Patreon release the free membership to air, right? That, that, that we've all, we started out being a little bit disgusted by, I've been slowly, I honest to goodness, I just, I just accept that it's there now.
Seeing Jack Conti's talk at South by Southwest really brought me along on what they were trying to do. As did I. And boy, just as an aside, I think both Brad and I would highly recommend you Google that talk. Yeah. In fact, I'll try to put a link to it in the show notes. I'll make a note to myself right now. I've just given more work to Brad. That's great. You can. And you gave me good advice, Dave. You said he talks about his life and he's he's he's a great person. He's had a great life.
but I'm kind of familiar with it. So Dave said, just fast forward about 15 minutes in to when he starts talking about some of these issues that Dave and I have been talking about for a long time. Both he and I have heard Jack's sort of standard. Here's my life. Here's how I got here speech about five times over the course of Patreon. So honestly, as Brad just said, skip 15, 20 minutes in and get to the meat of the talk. Yeah. But it's an eye opener and.
you're going to hear a lot of concepts that if you're a long time comic lab reader, they're going to sound very familiar. Yeah. We've been talking about for a long time. He does a very good job of summing it up. Anyway, anyway, Patreon's free membership tier, right? I'm warming up to it. Substack basically has the equivalent, although it's more, you know, built into the Substack.
landscape, but Substack, you also have a whole lot of people who are at their heart, free subscribers, right? So I'm trying to make posts that I can engage with those free members. Number one, to build community and to talk about myself to the extent that I'm willing to share and to talk and share other things like time lapse videos and and you know, the promotions that are coming up and all that kind of stuff.
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I've been doing a column that I call the week that was and the month that was. OK. Primarily for Patreon, but I also repurpose it and copy and paste it right into a sub stack where I say, hey, here's something I did this week. Right. The last one was I talked about going to an NCS Philadelphia chapter event in a private bar in Philly, which was, honest to God, ridiculously fun.
I think the subhead was I left the house and I liked it because I was one of the last people to leave. I was having so Dave Blazek, who you've heard on the show, Dave was there, a delight. A bunch of other people that I knew. Jamar Nicholas was there. Also friend of the show. We love Jamar. Terry Laban was there. Syndicated cartoons. A bunch of people that I've known. And then a bunch of people I was very happy to meet.
Tom Stiglich, the editorial cartoonist was there. Anyway, I had a blast. Well, I did. I had photos and this is what I did. And this is what we talked about, blah, blah, blah. And of course, at the bottom, by the way, I'm having a special offer on Patreon. If you'd like to sign up, this is a great time. Here's what you get. Or, you know, similar thing for Substack. And I've actually, not for nothing, have seen...
moderate results as a result of that. Kicking a couple of people up into the paid tiers every week. And then at the end of the month, I do a whole month -long wrap -up that here's all the stuff that I posted on Patreon this month. We're having so much fun. You really got to join us. You know, that kind of thing. And copy and paste that. I've already copied and pasted from Patreon into Substack. It's no big deal.
to copy and paste it while it's still in my clipboard to my blog. Right? So you've got lots and lots of options. I wouldn't think too hard on it. I would do what I would suggest my method, which is do it once and copy and paste it into a whole bunch of different places. Listen, there's going to be one or two readers that see it in two different places. They're going to just keep scrolling. They don't care. Mostly you've got
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different audience groups that you're building out there. And for the most part, you don't have to worry about somebody reading the same thing twice. My experience is that that happens very, very seldom. And again, if they do, they certainly don't complain about it. Most of them know the score. They know that Brad's an independent out here trying to make, trying to put a career together, trying to make it someday. And they give me a pass if they do notice it. So my advice to you,
Drop back to those four Cs, copy paste, copy paste, write it once, use it as many times as you can. I have no demonstrable additions to make to that because I think Brad absolutely nailed that landing. All I wish to say is that...
Remember that blogging was called blogging and social media when it first appeared was called microblogging. So you literally, like Brad said, can copy and paste six microblogs into one blog. That's a totally valid blog. Like here's six unrelated but interesting things, one of which is a link, one of which is a thing I did, one of which is a photo of a bird I saw. And then bada bing bada boom, there's your blog post for the day or the week. And so you don't need to overthink it. It's basically, as Brad always says, the four C's.
And Brad, just for everybody who might be tuning in for the first time to Patreon or to Comic Lab rather, what are the four C's that you've invented? Okay, okay, I can do this. Number one is content. That includes your comic but is not limited to your comic. That includes other things that come out of your brain. Other hosts, realizations, snippets from your brain.
Content not just limited to your comic really important there number two is commercial that's patreon Kickstarter all that kind of stuff number three is Curation that's you doing something that none of us do very easily, but we all need to do more That's you posting somebody else's work you saying hey, there's somebody doing work. I really like here's a repost of David I did it just not too long ago. I saw this guy post a
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A comic that filled me with laughter. It was these four fishes playing cards. One of them was a puffer fish and he puffed way up. And the, and the, and the caption at the bottom was real, very simple. Gary had a tell. One of the best single panel comics I've seen in a long time by Mr. Dave Kellett hit that retweet button immediately because why not? Right?
So curation and the fourth C is kindness. And of course we always joke because that's a K. It could also be comment, right? You need to go out and comment on other people's stuff. If you're going to make social media work. Now what that has to do with blogging, I'm not sure, but keep that in your back pocket. You might find a way to use it, but curation, content, commercial and kindness. Well,
In general, I just want to say for putting my friend Brad on the spot, he absolutely nailed the four C's of social media and of blogging. So I want to thank Brad for that one. It has been great to see you not forget the four C's. Yes, I got a fifth C. You ready for this? Here's my fifth C. You've been listening to Comic Lab, the show about making comics and making a living from comics.
Your hosts have been my friend Brad Geiger, the editor of WebComics .com and the creator of Evil Inc. at EvilComic .com and also the new Substack thing which he sprung on me but I don't have the new copy for. So who knows what that is? Just like, you know what, go to Substack, search for Geiger maybe, search for the word Webcomic, it's something to do like that. Hell yes. I've got no copy here to read from. You'll bump into me somewhere over there. And my good friend Dave Kellett.
co -director of the comics documentary Stripped and the cartoonist of Sheldon at SheldonComics .com and Drive at DriveComic .com. The Comic Lab theme song is used with permission from Andy Creighton at TheWorldRecord .net and this episode was edited by the ever wonderful and ever talented Matt Woodard of Woodsong Productions over at www .woodsong .media.
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If you love Comic Lab and we know that you do, you can rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts and on Spotify. And you may hear your review featured on a future episode. But honest to goodness, thank you so much for those five star reviews that are piling up over there on Spotify. You are absolutely helping us get this show out to more and more cartoonists. And Comic Lab is made possible by your support on Patreon .com slash Comic Lab. So I will go ahead and say that twice with a little added emphasis. Patreon .com.
Slash Comic Lab. Mmm, goes down smooth.
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There was enough. That was so smooth. It had an oil panel. fuck me. That was so smooth. It had an oil pattern all of its own. Bingo.